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Hagerty
Hagerty Employee

Avoidable Contact #92: Gates and ladders-all the ways old people kill young enthusiasm | Hagerty Media

Everything I need to know about life, I learned from my father and an anonymous psychiatrist. From Dad I learned that "People do what they want to do, and what they say they want isn't important." From the infamous Internet blogger "The Last Psychiatrist" I learned that "You're not a 'good person' because you have good intentions.
https://www.hagerty.com/media/opinion/avoidable-contact/avoidable-contact-92-gates-and-ladders-all-t...
357 REPLIES 357
el_zato
Intermediate Driver

LOL Great article, this deserves a toast.

I'm 43 and I will try to be less judgemental on poor-taste when it comes to cars. **bleep** automatics, though.
DaveE
New Driver

I try to always let kids sit in my car at cruise night or even car shows. As long as they aren't covered in ice cream or chocolate it isn't going to hurt anything and that minute in the "cool race car" can light the car bug fire in them. Talk to the people who are curious, help them understand stuff. Everyone can't afford a high $$$ car. Learn to appreciate all sorts of cars. If it's different or their passion complement the owner.
Alico87
Intermediate Driver

Great article again Jack! I'm not 40 yet, but have seen this happen so often. I have always told my friends that you have to appreciate every car even if it's not something you would personally own or build, as I've seen younger people gate keep as well. I dont like Hondas with loud exhaust but nothing else, but I do appreciate the many Civics that have been made unique by their owners. Keep the door open, let people see your car, let kids sit in your car, and at the end of the day, encourage the enthusiasm! In my late teens and early 20s I had a couple of Fox body Mustangs and an Eagle Talon TSi AWD ifykyk, no sooner would I start talking cars with someone 40+ than they would start talking about how much better the 60s were and big blocks and on and on... even though my reasonably modified cars would lay waste to their old cars, they just couldn't hear of it.

Let down the ladders and open the gates or we're all done for!
Jack_Hagerty
Moderator

DSM = Disposable Speed Machine! Talons forever!

thetossedtool
Intermediate Driver

This is great advice. Pre-COVID, I spent about 20 minutes listening to this young man talk about his plans for an old Mazda RX that had the nose "stitched" on with zip ties. He was so enthusiastic! I think we forget about the measures we used when we were young. For example, I pounded an old speed limit sign into the space where the floorboard should have been on my '63 Falcon (when it was just an old rusty used car).

I will say though. In spite of my sincere efforts, it is really hard not to make fun of old Hondamatic motorcycles! I guess I still have a lot of growing up to do!
Gene_M
Intermediate Driver

It really doesn't matter that you think you're a good writer, it's how you engage the reader. I read the first few paragraphs and that was enough for me to know that the real lesson you never learned is that everyone is in anything for one reason - their own enjoyment. The future generations have to fend for themselves, just like I did, and you know why - appreciation. If you attain something on your own you will appreciate it more than if it were handed to you. The other aspect is - if the new generation is interested in something they need to work at it on their own, just like most of us did. So the bottom line is go peddle your philosophy somewhere else.
Jack_Hagerty
Moderator

You really think that you had to "fend for yourself"? 

 

You grew up surrounded by a culture that made owning a car a necessity, and owning a cool car a ticket to everything from making lifelong friends to meeting a spouse, and you think it all just happened magically?  You were born in an era where a thousand bucks would get you anything from a tri-Five (if you're 75 now) to a Celica GT-S (if you're 50) and that just feels like something you created? Or something that didn't have any effect?

 

I owned a new BMW and a nearly-new 911 before I was thirty --- but I'm not arrogant enough to think I somehow earned everything from the cars themselves to the club infrastructure that surrounded it. I got help. From fellow enthusiasts. From track rats. From mechanics who wanted to see the cars they loved thrive. From mentors at dealerships and in the auto industry.

 

Today's kids have little to none of that infrastructure available. So instead of telling me how ignorant I am, maybe you can *show* me how ignorant I am by proving me wrong and by helping the next generation instead of gloating as you pull the ladder up behind you. 🙂

tdskip
Intermediate Driver

I wouldn’t take the haters here too seriously Jack - the knee jerk responses to imagined slights or observations that hit too close to home are pretty obvious. Anyone that pops off about politics here is frankly part of the problem, and if they don’t see why it just confirms why they are part of the problem.

RFD960
Pit Crew

Little to no young people are interested in cars because of rich white men trying their hardest to price them out of the hobby. Sites like BAT & Cars & Bids are a huge part of the problem. You have cars that are supposed to be "affordable classics" like 1992 Acura Legends and 1989 Preludes selling for 10k that should realistically be going for 3-4k. It's blatant gatekeeping, elitism and classism.
Then you have the "I buy junk cars" scumbags on FB Marketplace & CL who definitely haul off mint old people owned old cars that would make excellent first classic cars that need nothing or just little things fixed on them but go straight to the scrapheap so they can finance their drug and alcohol addictions.
GRAHAM_TR6
Pit Crew

My 20 year old son would love to drive my TR6. But he can't. Why?? Because Hagerty says he cant.
It is there in my policy, no one under 25 i think. Not even with me in the passenger seat.

You want young people to appreciate classics? Let them drive the damn things. Supervised at least.
Darold
Hagerty Employee

Hey there @GRAHAM_TR6, we absolutely encourage young drivers to get behind the wheel! As long as they have a clean driving record and a valid drivers license, we can certainly take a look at adding your son as a driver. I would love to look into this a little deeper if you could shoot me a PM!

hotrodbaby
New Driver

Great article. To those who are blind to these issues, I say that's too bad. There is a restaurant in a small town here in central Michigan that for years has a monthly cruise night that was limited to 1972 and earlier vehicles only. I'm 53 years old and grew up with late 70's and early 80's vehicles. I have a 1974 Z-28 and my wife has a 1975 Grand Prix . With the '72 and earlier rule, theoretically there will be a thinning of the heard with no willing replacements due to how they were treated when they just wanted to join the crowd and have their vehicle appreciated like everyone else. Real car people do not care what you drive. Real Car People enjoy talking to others who have the same passion and drive about the car culture. I enjoy talking with anyone that can actually tell me what and how they modified their vehicle. I see more issues with those who used their wallet to purchase a vehicle that was already done, or had a project commissioned. We need to remember were this hobby came from. Hot Rodding started out with modifying or building a vehicle from what you could find. The younger generations, I believe are at a disadvantage because they were always told they had to go to college in order to make money. I can tell you that is not true. I am an ASE Certified Master Automotive Technician including Light Duty Diesel certification. I went to trade school in the mid-eighties and busted my hump to perfect my skills. Because of my hard work and determination, I have been a technician, shop foreman, assistant manager, service manager and now I am working with a Big 3 Auto Manufacturer as an Instructor and working with suppliers and engineers to root cause assembly issues. I can say I am guilty of my own preconceptions of the tuner crowd. Like all other "groups" there are the bad apples. Car people are a very diverse group of people. I am not talking about race, I am talking about personalities. I've had conversations with people that look like they rolled in on their private jet, people that looked like they were part of the Hell's Angels, people that looked like they didn't have a pot to p*** in, the Joe schmo wearing jeans and T-shirt, the shaved head all tattooed from head to toe. The one thing that was a common thread, They could all tell me about what they drove, what was modified, how many long nights and countless hours they had sacrificed to enjoy their hobby. The car hobby needs to be all encompassing in order to survive. Yes, we have to keep our environment safe in order to sustain for generations to come, but people don't know how to discuss and compromise anymore. The roads are different now compared to when I first started driving. There is a substantial increase in the quantity of traffic, not allowing us to drive like we used to. Cars now have dramatically more horsepower than 30 or even 20 yrs ago. "Back in the day" a 400hp small block was a hot engine, now it's common place, even 1/2 ton trucks have 400hp now. The one thing this hobby needs, is mutual respect. We need to remember we are in a public atmosphere at shows, cruises or charity events and with that, we need to be mindful of language, music selection and volume. During the early years the car culture had a stigma of being a bunch of hoodlums. Now car groups are asked to assist with fund raising for many types of special causes. Even though, "WE", as a group, have a shared interest, we need to remember that we are indeed all different. That difference is what we need to stay vibrant to keep the hobby growing.
Spuds
Advanced Driver

Agree.Age restrictions just keep more people out.This isnt Pebble Beach we are talking.Young folks are the Japanese sports car crowd,keeping them out with newer cars is really short-sighted IMO.They are cool cars too.
MYTFAST
Intermediate Driver

Roughly almost 40% of the worlds population in 2020 in India & China combined and will still be utilizing oil/gas as a major energy source. With the U.S. increase in natural gas and solar/wind sources and the carbon emission reduction by autos, any reduction by the already carbon emission conscious U.S. is minuscule world wide. The impact on the current U.S. electrical grid, which is already overtaxed by the recharging requirements of electric vehicles will cause havoc U.S. wide & make us extremely vulnerable to attack on our already failing national electric grid. We would be easily overwhelmed by foreign military sources on our soil & once overcome by a foreign power, NOBODY WILL HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT CARBON SINCE SOMEONE OUR ENEMIES, WILL BE HERE INSTEAD OF US!!!!!!!
Alfanorth
New Driver

The global economy got turned off on a "whim"?
Spuds
Advanced Driver

Yes it did.An agenda.
Alfanorth
New Driver

🤦‍♂️

Michellehrand
New Driver

I agree with some of the other commenters here that this is not a generational thing. I am 61 and have been dinking around with vintage cars since I was 22, everything from restoration and showing, to racing and rallying, none of which I am very good at but all of which I thoroughly enjoy. I even broke apart derelict Bugeyes to sell the parts when I was in my early 30s, all over the world as it turned out. I am doing that now with a clutch of vintage Abarth parts.

In my experience, car people are sometimes their own worst enemies. "Don't Touch" and "my car is best" attitudes do none of us any good. My early cars were all small motored Brits; later I acquired large motored muscle cars and now we have some of everything. All along the way, folks in our hobby have sorted themselves as follows:

1. I could never put up with British/American/"fill in the car you happen to be driving now" cars; they break all the time/have no finesse/"other criticism"
2. I never thought about owning an MGA/Falcon/"whatever" but now that I see yours, I think it's groovy.

Within the last year I have helped refresh a teenager's knowledge of using a manual in our 1976 Alfa Alfetta, and taken a 6 year old for a hair raising ride around town in my 1961 MGA Coupe race car. I always hope that someone I reach out to in this way will find his or her way to the old car hobby.
MARK400
Intermediate Driver

Just so you know...... the Flathead guys did the same thing to the modern V8 guys back in the 50`s........and we all know how that turned out.
930Flachbau
Intermediate Driver

In short.....Do onto other enthusiasts as you would have them do onto you.
Figgy308
Intermediate Driver

Two things stop people getting into a hobby, in this case cars. Firstly is cost. This can be anything from the cost of entry to a show (make it free, even if only for kids) to the actual car. The second is the anti-social element. Coal rolling is funny once, but when you think about it if Prius owners went round throwing crap, literally, at pick-ups would is be funny? Not when you enjoying a hobby really interferes with someone else's hobby. There is absolutely no way faster to get a hobby banned than that.

Now yesterday I gave a nod to a young guy in an E34 540i. Very nice condition, not my cup o'tea but he gave a wave back and we both felt a little better about the day.
TG
Instructor

The first time i read this i was on a computer that doesn't automatically log into this account. So i walked away, did some things (tinkered on my 65 Impala), and thought about it for a while unintentionally. I came up with two things:
(1) I collect cars for two reasons - i want to and i can. period. nobody 'encouraged' me, i just plain like messing around with old cars and driving something interesting
(2) I can't remember the last time i encountered a young person i would call a car collector, enthusiast, or anything similar. I can't discourage them because i don't encounter them. When i was a young person, i wanted to do three things. we'll skip the first one but the last two were move out on my own and drive. Young people these days don't seem to want to do either of them. Driving is a hassle, they tend to like the idea of the self-driving car, and cars in general are viewed as strictly utilitarian devices. Ask a young person what they like about their car and i'll give you a dollar if it doesn't have something to do with social media or the ability to interface with their phone.
Now i know that isn't always the case from reading the articles here, but i just don't see the interest and enthusiasm in cars the way it existed when i was a kid
RFD960
Pit Crew

You privileged wealthy "collectors" are pricing them out of the hobby, and you wonder why there's no interest.
RFD960
Pit Crew

Lol ofc no one likes my comment. Can't handle the truth. You will never know what it's like to be stuck living in a 1197 sq ft house in one of the poorest cities in New England making 50K a year.
oldkidchris
New Driver

This goes for Harley owners too! Don't hate on anybody riding another brand of 2 or 3 wheels.
It's the love for ALL things motorcycles and the freedom of the road that matters. PERIOD!
Jost
Intermediate Driver

I guess we are in such a divisive climate these days. This sounds like dems vs. republicans, Old car guys vs. young car guys. I don't get it. I am 66 years old, going on 67. I have been hotrodding and drag racing and all the above since 16. Currently, my pleasure is a 2008 Mustang Gt. Not a Shelby, not this or that, just a nice GT. There are young eliests that look down their nose at me, old elitist's that do the same. Me, I love cars and i am happy to talk with any young people about how great their car is,regardless of what I "think" it should be. And many of my piers are the same, some are not. Jerks at any age. Lets stop the division all around us.. that Escort with the huge wing is as loved as the McLaren, maybe more? And to all the young enthusiasts, it was not perfect back in "the day". Cars broke, cars, we're damaged, people we're killed and hurt and in many ways it is better now. Take it from an older man who would love to talk with you about YOUR car.
Oldsmobile1988
Pit Crew

Jack makes some sense. But not for all of us. The ladders and gates go for all parts of our life. Not just car Enthusiasm. I support young people in hunting and shooting. I lend my guns and property and sometimes give guns to them because they can't afford them. It's important to me to keep them hunting and enjoying what I enjoyed all my life. I treat young people the same way with classic car collecting.Your point is well taken. But don't count me in on your sinking ship! I applaud young people who get involved in whatever they love to do. Although the constant looking at their phone has a tendency to bother me. If I see a young person involved in anything other than that I support them to the Moon and back.
RickB
Pit Crew

Just a side note, as emissions killing the gasoline engine always comes up in these conversations. Detroit (or what's left of it) has applied so many controls that the modern gas burning car has nothing left at the tailpipe but hot air, yet is is pushed to the head of the line at causing global warming and hurting the environment. There is little mention of the off-shore countries who's record on pollution is so bad that people dare not go out without a filter mask. It has been that way for decades, and continues. Also, the cars we worked on in the 40's, 50's, and 60's were approachable and could easily be fixed, in most cases with minimal knowledge and tools. Today's technology requires one to be a plumber, electronics wiz, and have $$$ in tools and the ability to use it. This will kill a hoppy faster than anything else and stifle any interest in mechanics.
mrhammered34
Pit Crew

our disappointment with older folks came many years ago at the Street Rod Nationals, the year was 1975, we got married and decided to make the Nationals part of our honeymoon, we drove our street rod to Memphis Tennessee, we registered and parked, walking around looking at all the beautiful rides, I noticed a couple of guys from Rod and Custom Magazine, we walked up to Tom Medley, he was standing next to Leroy "Tex" Smith, I introduced myself and my wife, I asked if they would take a picture of the newly weds and put it in Rod and Custom, Tom laughed and said " what are you guys doing here if your on your honeymoon, him and Tex had a big laugh as they walked away.
PSguy
New Driver

Perhaps the most illuminating thing about this article is how so many of the older guys commenting here deny that they are ever guilty of this conduct while the younger guy say: Yep that’s right. Comments like “Libtard“ turn off the younger socially conscious people from ever wanting to be part of the car community. As an officer of a car club who is working with fellow Board members to increase our membership I personally find Jack’s article very helpful.
Spuds
Advanced Driver

When I see a comment like LIBTARD Im done with that poster or person.I dont need that crap in my life at this point,hate is hate.And yeah,Im far from a liberal but insults dont cut it.
Bhobie
New Driver

With all due respect for what I think you were trying to convey , I can see why you need a shrink.
Jack_Hagerty
Moderator

Alas, if you'd read a little more attentively you would have seen that the psychiatrist mentioned is actually a writer.
darkbuddha
Pit Crew

Well written and not completely incorrect, and yet so conflicted and conflicting. There's an irony in the context of "you are what you do", when what a writer does is tell other people what they should do. Anyway, setting that aside, I'll admit to being the age of one of your "older readers" at 48. And sure, I've hoisted some ladders swung some gates, but I'd like to think equally in both directions. I run a locals-only car Facebook group (5.4k+ members), open to anybody, as long as they follow the non-overbearing rules about not advertising or otherwise being annoying enough to bothered by. Of course, it's disproportionately younger folks, all typically doing and wanting the kinds of things younger people are wont to do: street racing, burnouts, ruining perfectly good cars, spending excesses of money on perfectly awful cars, brodozer'ing, drifting, etc. etc. etc. But honestly, that's the way it should be, so we, my admins and I, let it ride, even when it creates sh*tstorms of drama, insults, and bickering, all provoked and perpetuated by those same younger folks. See, a lot of that stuff, whether we like it or not, is problematic whether you're >40 or <30, especially at our weekly meet event. It just is. Things have changed as much as we, the elders, have. Global warming is real, and it is a problem, more now than before, because science+math+time. Same for all the rest of it: there's more people, less room, more traffic, fewer outlets, more legal liability, less freedom, more consequences, less reward. And the game of being a car enthusiast is changing, swapping street cred for YouTube cred, real for sim lap times, fast for photogenicity, handling for stance life. And that's ok, because things CHANGE. And despite all the doomsaying or ladder/gate wielding, in a lot of ways, A LOT OF WAYS, it's better now that it's ever been. The availability of technology, information, social networking, aftermarket suppliers, boutique suppliers, niche groups, etc., all contribute to the survival of the folks wanting go fast, leave their elevens, and generally act an automotive menace. These kinds of folks are resilient, so much so, they're already restoring and hot rodding first gen Priuseseseses.

I also wanna say, IMHO, playing the game of gates and ladders isn't a function of age so much as (socio-)economics. I certainly continue to feel much much more sympathy and empathy with those struggling and yearning to make do with whatever they've got or want, than with those that (can afford to) raise ladders and slam gates, many of whom are well my junior. That's why I'm the guy that wanders the Tuesday night meet or Saturday cars and coffee or car show or auto-x, and spends a ton more time talking to the young guys with the hand-me-down project cars, or the dude quick-waxing his SHO, or the dude with the lowered 6 speed swapped Crown Vic, or the tatty 240DL. I've learned and taught more that way than I've ever gotten from debasing some static slammed 350z or boasting about scoring my '70 Mach 1 for cheap as my first car. My father is the same way, and he's 75. And despite being able to afford better, he continues to piece together tired and wrecked Saturns to daily and/or donate (to vets and needy families). So you see where I get it from. Sometimes it ain't about the years or mileage; it's about being able to enjoy the ride you can afford for what it is.
topher339
New Driver

Not seeing the problem doesn't make it not exist. If you haven't experienced these issues, then I'm happy for you but it does happen. I've been to meets where the older guys and their muscle cars want nothing to do with you unless you have not just a muscle car but the right kind of muscle car (can't be a vert, or a clone, or engine-swapped, or a sedan, etc) and will scoff at any attempt to join them.

I'm on a Mopar forum where a guy in his early 20s was engine swapping a nice old Charger. He wanted a modern EFI motor for better fuel economy, easier power, and better year-round drivability. There were a few people telling him he didn't deserve the car, that he should leave the forum and that he didn't belong there (this isn't some sort of concourse style forum mind you). That's textbook gate-keeping.

This certainly isn't representative of enthusiasts as a whole or even a majority, but to dismiss it entirely is simply denying reality.
ConfuciusRacing
Detailer

This isn't drivel, there are a bunch of small minds out there,

Sadly, and I'm 56, this happened to me, I attended a Datsun Roadster event after owning my car for 10 years, trailered the little girl down there to in Solvang, I have a 1965 Fairly with, yes, 27,xxx miles, and it's totally unrestored, in '64 there was a 1500 Fairly too and it had a jump seat in the back to avoid taxes in Japan being a 3 person car, all 3 1500's are parked at the show and shine car show and a big wheel in the club walks up to me and says: "Too bad you don't have a real 1500, and walked off and sniggered...This was the guy other people in the club told me I should talk to to get parts and help as the 1500, IS a bit of an oddball for parts...well, my reply? Hey buddy, my car is as real as yours...But you know what?

Of course his car was seriously over restored, and did look good, but what an "A hole".

I never went back and threw the 'join the Datsun Roadster Owners club' flyers in the...trash.

Fast way to kill the enthusiasm for the brand and as the author points out, for the hobby.
More_Oil
Pit Crew

Thanks for the article. This does contain some truth and accuracy in many of the points made. There are a lot of _ricks out there. They act like cliquish high school girls only meaner. It’s like any social circle.  I don’t however  agree that it’s harder for young enthusiasts though. If they are driven by their passion they will find a way to get involved. There is still a bunch of great people in the collector/classic car world; they’re everywhere you just need to look. 

DrillNFill
New Driver

Excellent article. As a 40-ish car enthusiast I've experienced some of the "gates and ladders" discussed. The local car club my father is involved with has an archaic membership requirement of a car older than 1972 (I guess a 48-year old car doesn't qualify as a "classic" in their eyes).
We as car people need to stick together, before the "man" forces us all into electric Tupperware autonomous transportation pods.
Local52Carp
New Driver

Boy did this one beat the whiny, pissy, angry name-callers out of the bushes. Well hold on to your diminutive members, cause I’ve got a whole lot of something to say to you bunch. Let me start off by telling you who I am, because I think that will say a good deal.

I’m 33 years old, the eight-year owner of a now heavily hot-rodded ’68 MkI Triumph GT6 that I drive hard enough to have broken upgraded axles, and far enough to have (on multiple occasions) gotten caught in rainstorms with DOT slicks on, but had to drive on anyway through multiple states just to get home. I grew up going to car shows like those at the Marcus Dairy on Saturday nights, and road races at courses like Lime Rock and Watkins Glen. I’ve been to Speed Week on the Bonneville Salt Flats, driven up Mount Washington and Pikes Peak. I’m a proud workingclass, 11-year card-carrying Union Shopcraftsman. I work hard for a living, make good money and pay good taxes. I’m a hardcore, old-school New Englander, and proud to be an American in the tradition of those many educated, hard-working, principled Americans before me. I don’t care what your race, nationality, religion, sex, gender, hair color or displacement is, though I’d prefer you had a manual transmission. I’m college-educated at a very small, very intense and demanding liberal arts college, an aspiring landowning permacultural farmer, and die-hard environmentalist. I love 20s Bugattis, 30s highboy flathead Fords, 50s gassers, 60s trans Am muscle, 70s endurance racers, 80s Euro rally cars, 90s Japanese drift cars, everything before, after, and in between. I have my own taste, but fast, slow, stock, mod, rare, common - I can appreciate it all.

Let me analogize by putting it this way: I am, in addition to those many other things, also a life-long photographer. But the photography I love is film photography - developed in a can with chemicals, printed in black and white on paper coated with light-sensitive emulsion. This is what I love to do and what interests me, but that doesn’t mean I have to rail against the existence of digital photography. I use and enjoy digital photography, and the fact that the technology is so vastly available and used is a great gift to the world. Period. Efficient, clean, continuously progressive technology to perform a necessary task is hardly something to hate. One’s broader support does not mean the other needs to or will be ended. There is a place for the cultural richness afforded by conventional photography, as there is a place for that of gasoline-burning, fire-spitting internal combustion engines. But every human on planet earth does not need to burn petroleum to get from place to place every day, just because you feel like it. If you think that polluting as much as you want whenever you want is your god-given right, then maybe you ought to consider that your liberty ends where others’ begins. And as a protector of my country’s land, water, and air, I expect every American to be held to equal account. The only ones making this a divisive argument on a damn CLASSIC CAR INSURANCE WEBSITE are those of you who just want to be the loudmouth a$$høle that Americans like me cringe at every time you rear your ugly heads. You’re pretty brave in the comments section, but let’s see you call me a libtard to my face.

The fact is, there’s plenty of encouraging stuff happening in car culture now – in fact, more than ever. It’s just that closed-minded people like those the author is talking about refuse to allow its existence when they have any say in the matter. Well, some news here - it exists anyway. Though we could use more of them, race series like LeMons, Gambler, and Gridlife GLTC are very cool steps in the right direction. Countless aftermarket parts manufacturers from cottage to factory are popping up for almost every sort of vehicle. Look at the virtual community on Youtube alone. People I follow like Jimmy Oakes, The Vargas Brothers, Garrett Mitchell (aka Cleetus McFarland), Stephan Papadakis, Mike Finnigan, Jay Leno, and all the many guys over at Hoonigan, Grind Hard Plumbing, and Donut just to name a few… these are inclusive, interested, positive voices for car culture. But you angry red-hats and bluebloods out there, screaming names, muttering slights, “pulling ladders,” or “closing gates” at anybody not like you – you’re only making a bad name for gearheads, and moreover, a bad name for Americans. You’re hardly protecting our culture from extinction - the only thing you’re succeeding in doing is ruining it for the rest of us. You’re entitled and outspoken so you think you’re right. In that respect, the author is dead effin right, and you’re proving the point for him.

From my perspective, even with my life-long interest, I can honestly say that until I was well out of college and had saved a good deal of money, I felt that cars weren’t for me. It was something to appreciate as a spectator. I wasn’t lucky enough to know people who could teach me what I wanted to know. I didn’t even own a vehicle until I was 21 when I bought my little work truck. Many of you are right in saying that there are a vast number of approachable, inviting people in the car world, but until recently, despite my genuine interest, it was always kind of tough to find ways to educate myself in my spare time. Times are different, but we are the ones to inherit this culture, and I for one want to make it a community that values intelligence and kindness.
Bigspanner
Intermediate Driver

Except no one passed a law making the sale of traditional cameras illegal, forcing photographers to buy a digital camera. As the digital camera technology improved, most photographers went digital. Those that wanted to stay with traditional film can still buy and use a non-digital camera if they wish. Not so much with ICE vehicles, thanks to the misguided and hypocritical lefties. Save the planet! Kiss my @SS.

70sKid
Pit Crew

Wake up. Unless it's built in to a smartphone, digital cameras as most know them are going the way of things like the ICE and CD's. As hard as it might be to imagine a world without the ICE and Nikon, it's coming our way and it's got nothing to do with the lefties.
Kewina50
Intermediate Driver

I'm going to come straight to the point. This article sucked and Jack reminds me of a snobby-ass moron.
DAK
New Driver

Doesn’t matter what arena or hobby your into, everyone before you had to walk up hill both ways in 3ft of snow (by their own account). Personally I say keep the history and tradition stories going old men/women. My perspective comes from being a mechanic by trade and now engineer in automotive. I’m almost 40 myself, now financially independent, I’m finally able to build the cars I always wanted as a kid but didn’t have the means. Like the shoemaker who walks around soleless, for years I worked on other people’s things and never pursued my own dreams. It’s also hard for me to want to keep that classic 350 w/ carb under the hood when I can build the LS3 fuel injected. I think it’s important to understand the benefits and short falls of current technologies in automotive to gage the gates. I think the young buck who’s headstrong enough to argue the Ol timer on why his turbo 4cyl 10 speed is better than their old lift and close door vehicle, will keep the traditions alive anyway, and his reinforcement will argue that not needing wheels to touch the ground is better yet.
Verneoz
Pit Crew

"“You’re not a ‘good person’ because you have good intentions. You are the sum total of your actions.” This quote is somewhat misleading. There have been many "actions" done with "good intentions" that had devastating effects on the people of this nation. One big example is The War On Poverty enacted in 1965. 55 years and over $23 trillion later poverty levels of today are virtually the same as in 1965. The taxpayers were the big losers in this "guilt complex" exercise that eroded the self reliance and personal responsibility of tens of millions of poor Americans of all races & ethnicities. This article also has good intentions such as discrediting the advice of older people so young people can do great things. Well, young people do not have experience. They can ignore what old people say at their own self destruction & bad decisions.
tee_zee65
New Driver

As a high school shop teacher I always encourage young students to fix and drive what they like. The time to pull up the ladder so to speak is when they do dangerous things in the name of trends. When I was in school it was a lot different owning a 16 second car that felt fast at the time, with functioning brakes. Now skip to a V6 Mustang not as cool as a V8 but affordable and faster than that old 318 Satellite, the Plymouth had drum brakes but again functional and basic. Rake the car
and then accidentally cut up the rear meats when the air shock lines burst being to close to the exhaust. Now take the V6 Mustang driving around with the exhaust cut off just enough to let it into the cabin because cats are "bad" and rob 800hp, try to convince a 17 year old any different. The ABS brakes are not working, then slap on an eBay turbo and some other goodies oh and don't forget stance. Now lets say low 14s maybe 13s or better oh and some NOS. Now add a rolling start or the track and drift scene and you have a Fu$%#ng death trap, big difference than racing up Woodward at top speed of 83mph if you were lucky, remember this is the average kid we are talking about.
danp
New Driver

I suppose that it has nothing to do with the kids not liking to work with their hands, get dirty, perform physical labor or do anything that doesn't have a screen and little buttons.  Maybe if they could get pajamas with little Camaro's and Mustangs on them they might take interest.  And if the car won't start maybe mommy could still get them a participation trophy.

NITRO450EXP
Instructor

https://www.wsj.com/articles/this-ford-is-straight-out-of-the-70s-8-track-included-11608375600

 

This kid is local, I see the truck up at our local church weekly car show.

There is still hope, the young still find a way to get into the hobby and keep old family trucks and cars alive, but I fear city kids not so much.

Hopefully more find their way to our hobby.

 

Nitro

 

bamcintyre
Pit Crew

Jack,
I am 73 and drive one of those 15 year old Infiniti G35 coupes. It is a great ride. I gotta say I still smile every time I drive it. Bullet proof. 201,144 miles with no major repairs. Try one out.
BTW, I also drive a 2019 Corvette GrandSport.
bamcintyre
Pit Crew

Oh yeah,

I forgot to add I let my 14 year old grand daughter drive the GrandSport as a part of teaching the fundamentals of driving.

My Corvette friends were aghast.

Best grandpa ever!!

I am finishing the frame off restoration of a 65 Corvette that is destined for my 34 year old nephew.

Delray210
New Driver

I have been a automotive Teacher for 21 years. It has been my experience the kids you are talking about will be Technicians of the future because they are out there doing something with their cars. When I see a student pull up in a new car Mom and Dad just bought them chances are they are not going be interested in working on cars. Give me the kid who does not have money in the lowered Honda or the kids who are out working on their Diesel trucks they will be the the ones working in the future.