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Hagerty
Hagerty Employee

Avoidable Contact #92: Gates and ladders-all the ways old people kill young enthusiasm | Hagerty Media

Everything I need to know about life, I learned from my father and an anonymous psychiatrist. From Dad I learned that "People do what they want to do, and what they say they want isn't important." From the infamous Internet blogger "The Last Psychiatrist" I learned that "You're not a 'good person' because you have good intentions.
https://www.hagerty.com/media/opinion/avoidable-contact/avoidable-contact-92-gates-and-ladders-all-t...
357 REPLIES 357
Jack_Hagerty
Moderator

I've talked a lot to Heyward Wagner about this.

I think we need to give drifters a chance to share events with autocross. That would be a great time for everyone.
CarciergeReggie
Detailer

Bravo very well written, I was literally laughing out loud! Yes, get out there and help the next generation, I know I had a group of street rodders who taught me so much about the hobby, sure my dad lit the fire but they throw gas on the flame!
rust2gold
New Driver

Oh come on. Man made global warming is NOT real. It's just a way to separate us from our money!
Keep politics out of this forum
Tony
Pit Crew

AGREE, . . . The Worlds Governments can't stop the Kung Flu, But if we pay more taxes they will stop global warning ! Really, . . . ?
Jack_Hagerty
Moderator

If you read the article closely, you'll see that I am criticizing that opinion, not endorsing it. 🙂
MisterTorgue
Intermediate Driver

@rust2gold  What an astonishing display of pure ignorance.

 

For the record before you lash out, I don't align with either party. In fact climate change shouldn't be political. It exists, and it is going to destroy our hobby if car people aren't part of the conversation. Otherwise someone who sees cars as transportation only and can't understand why anyone has a need for an old car will legislate it for us and then we will be stuck picking up the pieces of our complacency. 

Historian
Detailer

You start out with "What an astonishing display of pure ignorance." and then bombard us with pure ignorance.
rust2gold
New Driver

Why must you insist on perpetuating the lie of man made global warming?  As a scientist and pilot, I've studied this topic and the climate extensively and I repeat there is no evidence man can cause global warming. You must look to the sun for the cause. Please keep this about cars and not you repeating proven lies.

bblhed
Advanced Driver

Do I really have to list the names of my friends that no longer enjoy fast cars because of how dead they are so you understand that while driving at insane speeds is a whole lot of fun, it can also be a one way ticket to no longer driving fast cars? I can also list a few names of dead before 40's that overdosed because they got hooked on oxies after a huge accident. You might also want to do a quick search for "Bride killed on wedding day" to find out that breakneck speed doesn't always break just the drivers neck. Speed, especially illegal speed has a place, but that place is out were there are a lot less people, cars, or objects to hit.

As for the rest of it, I will probably help a kid beat emissions, wire the crazy light show, or whatever other thing they want to do to make their car theirs, and if you want to drive grey market cool, but good luck with getting parts but that is part of the allurer isn't it? Ironically I am looking to score a set of European tail lights for a 2007 Sienna because I want yellow rear blinkers.

There is almost no segment of the hobby that I really and truly hate, some things aren't to my taste but they are making people happy so that is fine with me. But one thing that I can not stand is open road coal rolling! I had a next door neighbor that used to coal roll up the street every now and then but in a residential neighborhood with almost no traffic that is fine and looked really cool from my porch. You know what isn't cool? Being inside that smoke when you are doing 75 on the highway in a convertible so you not only can't see, but also can't breathe.

As for that kid at the car show with the less than pristine car, I was that kid once and I will probably stop by their car at every single cruise night just to see and encourage any progress they are making. This also reminds me that I want to do my own "Drive at dawn" this year where locals with whatever can make it get to hang out before sunrise.

Lets talk Gates and Ladders, I believe it is Hagerty's policy that your "collector" car can not be your primary transportation, it has to be kept in a locked garage, and that locked garage has to have hard sides (can't be a tent).
Jack_Hagerty
Moderator

I'm not saying it's right to race on public roads.

I *am* saying it's rich to hear people who did that for YEARS now trying to force their mature opinions on young people.

As for the insurance stuff --- part of the reason the company can be so good about fixing cars RIGHT is that we know they are stored RIGHT as well.
joet
Pit Crew

I disagree entirely with your comment about emissions equipment. Unless you are racing or off roading with a car that does not go on public roads, removing any emissions controls makes you something of a douche. Ditto racing on public streets--that hardly elevates the old car hobby.
AG1962
Detailer

I think those of us “over 40” (I’m 58) are starting to have trouble accepting change, just like most people do after a certain age. Aging gracefully involves acceptance of change as well as valuing what we have achieved. Good for you, Jack, for insisting on that.

As for our hobby: yes, it is in trouble, demographically. My kids have no real interest in cars, and would just as soon be driven around by some AI program (though I agree that THAT is a very long way off). I won’t annoy them by leaving them any vintage vehicles when my time comes. I also think that by 2050, internal-combustion cars will be as rare and seem just as obsolete as horse-drawn carriages in 1950. We need to get used to the idea that gas cars will eventually become a niche hobby for rich people or hands-on country people, just like horses are now.

Finally, I don’t understand why you felt the need to describe pandemic restrictions designed to slow the spread of COVID-19 until vaccination is well underway as a “whim”, and I especially don’t see what it has to do with our hobby: you are still free to drive as much as you like — unlike, say, those under lockdown in some other countries. And anyone can wrench, even if it is a lot less fun without our buddies around. Maybe you’re just crabby, and I get that too.
Jack_Hagerty
Moderator

I'm a little crabby, yeah. My grandmother just died of pneumonia in a hospital that was more worried about testing her for COVID on a daily basis than they were about addressing the pneumonia. Why? There's no federal money for pneumonia cases.
mwmyers91
Detailer

Jack, so sorry to hear about your loss. I just went through this exact thing with my wife, she survived but it was way to close. There seems to be a collective insanity happening, may God help us all.
Swamibob
Instructor

My condolences on your loss also. A friend of mine suffered through a similar situation. Lot of money if anything can be called COVID or COVID related, but it it's flu or pneumonia, God help you.
jjw
Intermediate Driver

While I don't doubt that snobbery and dismissiveness of the older generation is a problem, that issue is as old as humanity itself... "They don't make *blank* like they used to"... (insert your favorite item at the "blank").
I remember all those years ago when I bought my first ailing MGB, I distinctly remember a conversation with an older marque enthusiast (TD owner)... "kid, those B's are too new and they made too many of 'em, why would you want to put a lot of time and money there"...
I think the real thing challenging younger enthusiasts is the financial aspect. When I was in high school one get get a roadable, interesting car for a few hundred bucks... this is what we cut our teeth on in the mechanical game, and kept us looking for more. Cheap to buy, cheap to run. But today the cost of entry is much higher, and "safety" inspection standards (in many states) are much stricter than they were back it the day, so keeping that car on the road with a few bucks worth of bailing wire and Marvel Mystery Oil is long gone... add maintenance complexity to the equation and there are your enthusiasm dampers... Times change...
One old guy's opinion...
Jim1969
Intermediate Driver

Thrillseeker, my fellow car guy, what’s a libtard?
Sgvette11
Pit Crew

Sorry, but the use of “old people” in the title made it clear where this article was going. A nice, long insulting bash of those old folks you clearly dislike so much. Nice touch trying to disingenuously “include” yourself because of you being over 40. This article is just a re-hash of all those posting and comments that appear to be a source of personal annoyance, not anything that would affect “young people’s” interest in the hobby in any discernible way. It’s also not remotely as clever/snarky/hip as you congratulate yourself for, either.
Jack_Hagerty
Moderator

I think if you read through, you'll find a lot of "old guys" agreeing with me, even ones who are older than 49.

And trust me, 49 might seem young to you --- I have no idea how old you are --- but to a 25-year-old it's the same as being 69.
ThumperUSMC
Intermediate Driver

Personally, I'm not offended by your writing at all. I am in my upper 60's and I find what you write to be very true. As a kid, I loved my Tri-5's as back then they were relatively cheap, ( I say relatively because back then, mid 60's 75 bucks was a lot of money for a teenager to have ). Some were great cars, like my 57 Bel Air Convertible that I bought for $75, with the 283 non-fuel injected motor, that I wish I still had... A lot more were 54 Fords, Tri-5 Chevie's with the enemic but cool 265 V8's, 57 Plymouths and even a 58 Chevy. A bunch more had even "lesser" cars, but we ran what we had, and we usually spurned the "rich kids" with their brand new 65 GTX's, or Mustangs which were cool, but way above our price range. Today's youth are no different, but a lot have their G35's or Toyota Celicas or Hondas because they cannot afford anything else. Not a damn thing wrong with that. My grandson is one of the more fortunate because I have always included him in my love for cars and at the age of 10 at the time, I had him working on one of my older Corvettes, partly because it was easier for him to dig in to change the plugs without having to put it up on a lift, he loves to get his hands dirty working on things and I have gotten him to love motorcycles as I do, also. he turns 16 in almopst 2 weeks, and he is getting that same 1980 Corvette, with the L-82 motor, the headers and sidepipes and the Cragar SS's on the new tires for his birthday. He knows what it'll do for speed and he also knows the ideosynchrosies of the beast and how it drives, because I have had him driving it with his learners permit with me in it, and we have "practiced it all" with that car. I am proud of him, because he is not only a "gear head" but also an A student on the honor roles of his school and is responsible enough that I trust him with having that car, that has been mine for the last 41 years, being the original owner. He will also be given all the original items, wheels, exhaust, brake calipers, AM/FM with cassette, etc,, as I have never gotten rid of them, but have them stored, should he ever decide he wants it to be "original". I can only hope that when he has kids, he will teach them in the love of vehicles, be they what they will be, by the time they are old to be driving.
lwampler
New Driver

I just wasted brain cells and 5 minutes of my life reading this article.
MisterTorgue
Intermediate Driver

You say it like you had some cells to loose, in that case, congratulations! Nice job identifying yourself as the EXACT person illustrated in the piece.

Historian
Detailer

Your snarky, insulting comments throughout, identifies YOU as why some of those grumpy old guys treat younger people the way they do. Get off your sanctimonious high horse, look in the mirror, and grow up.
MisterTorgue
Intermediate Driver

Look, calling a jerk where there is one. Fine if you feel the need to stick up for them, however I would read the article and see things through the eyes of the younger enthusiasts who are sick of the do as I say, not as I have done crowd that came before us.

Historian
Detailer

So, anyone who doesn't agree with you is a jerk...  My, but you are quite the sensitive one, aren't you!  I suggest you grow a spine and quit being so easily offended and attributing your perceived insult to something it isn't.  Perhaps someone being rude to you doesn't have anything to do with your age, or theirs, but rather your attitude and hostile nature.  Maybe they are just jerks, or maybe you are acting like one.  You don't deserve a participation trophy because you like cars.

 

This ageism nonsense in your comments and in the article is all BS.  I am an old guy, and I am here to tell you that people acting like jerks has nothing to do with age.  I have watched, and endured jerk-ish behavior from old and young alike.  Sometimes it is based on economic status, sometimes it is based on personal preferences.  And sometimes it is simply because the offender is just a jerk, and there is no reason or trigger whatsoever.  The question is, why do you take such crap personally, and let it color your own behavior?

 

Personally, I don't go to car shows, join clubs, don't do cars & coffee, or participate in any organized activity whatsoever.  True, you will encounter jerks wherever you go, but my reason is that I don't have any need to feel validated by socializing with other car people.

 

I build cars because I love cars, and would do it even if I was the only car owner in the world.  I don't care what other people think or do.  I live by the motto of "my car, my money, my work".  If you like what I do, fine, and if you think it is hideous, that is fine too.  I simply do not care, either way.

 

I am currently building an old Corvette.  I am modding it heavily.  There are Corvette snobs out there who scoff and think what I am doing is a crime of nature.  There are also people who think what I am doing is awesome.  Neither negative or positive reactions of other people effect what I do whatsoever.  It is what "I like", that drives me.  And that is all that matters.  It has been that way since I first picked up a wrench as a kid.

 

I don't attack other people for their choice of car, color, brand, style or preference.  If you like it, that is all that matters.  I may think that something is silly, but I mostly keep my opinions to myself, unless you ask my opinion.  Then I will give you an honest answer.  By the same token, I don't ask others for their opinion.  If someone tries to force their opinion on me, I meet it with the reaction it deserves.  I don't waste time trying to analyze why that person is a jerk, or let it offend me other than a momentary reaction.  I am too busy doing my thing to worry about others.  If you are going to work on cars, you need to grow thicker skin, literally and figuratively.

 

The only people who bother me are economic snobs.  The guys who never work on their own cars, and pay someone else to do their dirty work, and whose biggest dilemma is what car polish to buy.  And they don't really bother me, but rather make me laugh at them.

 

In summary, you need a spine, you need a thick skin, and you need a sense of humor.  And just focus on what floats your boat.  You, or nobody else is going to change the world!

Jack_Hagerty
Moderator

A lot of people did!

If I'm wrong, tell me how I'm wrong. It's never too late to learn.
Sgvette11
Pit Crew

I told you twice. The article panders to the “hate the old folks crowd” and nothing else. Its a cheap shot, click bait, look how simultaneously sanctimonious and cool I am hit piece.
Jim1969
Intermediate Driver

Come on Iwampler, dig a little deeper in your thought process. You’ll get it.
Sgvette11
Pit Crew

It’s click-bait articles like this that get people on the Internet howling at each other. Old People talk like this, ya know, so be sure to hate them. It’s their fault Young People arent interested in cars, ya know. My position is this: if a young person wants to hear about my history with cars, Ill tell him. If he has questions about my cars at a show, Ill answer them. If you ask me about restomods or fart-can Civics, I’m sorry if this hurts your feelings, but they dont interest me. But this Old People hate and Blame Game thats so popular in society today is something I’m not interested in participating in. I certainly dont want to read another article promoting it.
win59
Detailer

Lots of good food for thought here regarding cars AND human nature. Have to laugh at some of the narcissistic commenters with short memories and poor comprehension skills here. Sheesh.
Thanks Jack!
Aaron
Pit Crew

There is so much here that I agree with, and my general philosophy is "if you're into, then good on ya." I mostly don't care. Donk it, drop it, safari it, whatever.

There are two points here, however, that I have problems with. The first is the idea that "rolling coal" is just another youth auto trend. It's not. It's a political statement. It says "I hate the values that drove your decision to buy your e-car, and I'm going to negate your value." That's not car culture. That's hate.

The other point I find troubling is the idea that the pandemic response amounts to "a whim." The families of 448,000 dead Americans might take issue with such disrespect.
Jack_Hagerty
Moderator

I'm in one of those families, for what it's worth.

bkmcgraw62
Pit Crew

I'm at a loss for what this article is supposed to be telling me. Seems like a lot of nonsensical dribble from someone with a guilty conscience? Maybe he should re-engage with the shrink. Dude, you got issues! I welcome anyone and everyone who has even a remote interest in cars no matter the age, preferences or style, with the possible exception of the crowd that puts an LS in everything (they need serious intervention).
I'm trying to expose the next generations to the Model T, and that is tough for a variety of reasons, but very worthwhile. Keep an open mind and an open heart is my motto. Except when it comes to Bowties...
69RS-SS
New Driver

Young people need to be encouraged whether it has to do with cars or anything else. I’m also an active hunter, and most hunters only want to tell you about their kill or their hunt, they’re not interested in your hunting story. When a young person talks to me about their personal hunt I do not even talk about mine because I want them to be excited of their accomplishment. Same with car enthusiast. I’m sure many hot rodders from the 40’s & 50’s didn’t think much of the 60 & 70 muscle cars. Yet most encouraged the younger generation to have a hobby working, building and driving cars of their generation. I learned this wisdom of building relationships with younger generations from the Bible. Young people need to be taught Godly moral values plus this opens a door that young folks will at least listen to you without immediately turning you off. It really doesn’t matter what model, make or year car you have, when your gone someone else will own it.
Srmert
Intermediate Driver

Wow, some folks get really fired up on this. Let me say I have to agree that I have experienced the bad. Happened both as a younger enthusiast and even when I was older. Some folks have a need to show dominance. Kind of a Darwinism of pack mentality. The strongest has to show their strength, even when wrong. We all know about opinions, but do they really matter?
The best thing about age should be about passing on your wisdom, to your own, and to others. Along with that wisdom, pass along some of that passion for autos, bikes, trucks, etc.
llawrence9
Intermediate Driver

I'm going to be 70. I know people who would be the age of my grandkids who drive the same car I drive, a 240 Volvo. I have learned from them and swapped parts with them, keeping them all on the road.
Bunheaded oranged haired young men with tats also have amusing stories. Learn to listen. And laugh.
A 5.0 in a 240 with Jag calipers is a fun car to drive. Left my number if it is for sale.
We swap various home brew recipies.
My riceburner, really more like a slow cooker is a 1986 Hondoo Shuttle AWD. I'm bored with it and will pass it along at a Japanese Car meet this spring.
Life belongs to the living, so after I get my vax, I will go back to living it.
Who wants to hang solely with alta cockers?
JAG
Intermediate Driver

Not sure about the ladders, but I am clearly guilty of the gates! Every generation to date has, or had targeted aspirational vehicles. Too be sure, there are pockets of car crazy people, my son is 33 and looking for his birth year car an 87 GN. My 23 year old nephew is building a crazy turbo Civic, but what is depressing is that we are living in the final days of that. The electric car move is the end of the road. Sure they can be fast and great looking but 1/2 the fun is the audio. We can all differentiate cars by sounds, and the physical rush/joy of the roar and power as they go by. It's like losing the sense of hearing. Every watch any of the open wheel E racing? Fast but boring. I own eight cars from 67-02 that aren't my daily drivers, love them all and never though I would say it but the end is near. Even worse I plan to start selling this spring.
Bostwick9
Intermediate Driver

I can see it. But I've been more doctrinaire in my youth than now. I never would have considered a non Big Three brand. VWs ? Ugh. Japanese cars ? Never.
What a mistake. Perhaps because the Big Three abandoned me or I got more curious about what was outside the US. Now my fantasy garage would include an '70
Audi 100, Morris Marina, '60s Corona, Austin Allegro, 74 Datsun B 210 along with Studebaker Larks and Ramblers.
By the time I saw a right hand drive Honda Civic driving down Golf Links here in Tucson, all I could do was smile and give a thumbs up.
Then again, maybe once a misfit, always a misfit. All three of my cars are from orphaned brands.
Bigspanner
Intermediate Driver

Great article. And it hits home. This isn’t a response about the “good ol’ days”. This is my observation as to what is about to happen if everyone sits back and shrugs their shoulders. There are major forces afoot in North America intended to end oil and gas consumption by consumers in an attempt to kill the domestic oil and gas industry. Those at the lead of this movement believe that any use of a vehicle beyond essential travel is a overt demonstration of privilege, and the blame for all of the world’s ills. It’s a government movement well underway in Canada already, where the “woke” federal government has drastically restricted the oil industry in getting its product to market, and practically ended any new developments in oil and gas (Canada’s number one export, by a large margin, btw). It’s all hypocritical BTW, as most left-wing movements are, as oil and gas consumption will continue in North America and worldwide, particularly Asia and Africa, and the only winners here are countries with horrific human rights and political track records - Saudi Arabia, Russia, Venezuela, etc. A slow clap for the liberals here. Well done. State and provincial announcements outlawing the future sales of ICE-powered vehicles are just the first step onto a very slippery slope. Massive “carbon tax” increases will be added to gas and diesel (already underway in Canada, where gas prices will double again in the next three years). Expect federal and state “cash for clunkers” programs shortly that encourages crushing cars and trucks for big discounts on EVs, all at your expense (taxpayer). When that doesn’t work, expect a major push to end gas and diesel sales to consumers. The media efforts are well underway, with many “articles” highlighting how millennials and Gen z’ers prefer their phones over cars, and don’t even bother to get a driver’s license (as with most media nowadays, the actual data doesn’t back up these stories. Tesla manufactures less than 1% of cars worldwide and loses money any every car sold, yet their stock value is more than the top 12 car companies - COMBINED! This can’t be real, and yet it is. And don’t get me started on how good old American freedom and civil liberties will be decimated when all EV vehicles are controlled by the “grid”. As the writer says, we all need to do what we can to support anyone interested in this sector. Yet I hear many car “enthusiasts” shrug their shoulders and say that it doesn’t matter if you can’t buy an ICE vehicle anymore because they already have their Mustang, Jeep, Bronco, F150, Porsche, Range Rover, Corvette, Ferrari, etc, in the garage and they plan on keeping it. What these “enthusiasts” are missing here is that end of gas and diesel sales means the end of their “classic”. No matter what the current value is, no gas stations and no gas sales means their “classic” is now relegated to worthless yard art status. If you sit back and watch, it will happen. And a lot more quickly than you ever thought. If you’re a car enthusiast, it’s not going to be pretty.
Jack_Hagerty
Moderator

Exceptionally well said, thank you.

NightRanger
Intermediate Driver

Your complaints about the Canadian government are just a bit disingenuous. The Canadian government is actually a bit schizophrenic over the oil industry. It wants to reduce carbon, but also wants to support the lucrative oil industry. It is NOT trying to prevent transport of oil to port. In fact it bought a pipeline expansion project under construction to the west coast that was under threat of shutdown due to various environmental and native organizations. That pipeline is so far going ahead, forced through by the feds. Other plans to build a pipeline eastward were abandoned when the Ontario and especially Quebec provincial governments put up political roadblocks, which the feds could probably have overruled. It was originally approved by the feds. But the legal process would likely have taken a decade to go through. In reality it is the US government that is blocking transport of Canadian oil by shutting down the Keystone pipeline after it is already well along the way to completion. (The US is not shutting down any of their own pipeline construction, -only that coming from Canada ...hmmm).
The Canadian govt has not ended new development by any means. (Resource development is not under federal control anyway, it's provincial.) Oil companies are reluctant to privately invest in new development and have trouble raising capital under the current worldwide conditions. Yes, Canada has a carbon tax that adds just over 6 cents to the price of a liter of gas -equivalent to about 17 cents US per US gallon. That will rise to about 37 cents per liter in the future, so yes the price of gas is going up, but gas prices won't "double again in the next three years".
I am by no means a big fan of the Canadian government. But I believe in truth and facts. I am in fact employed in the petroleum industry (geologist in Alberta).
chrlsful
Instructor

much of what U mention is just plane mean, no older person hasa market on that. I'd talk more abt those who mod more than rest0. The real icons - late '30s us of a, '50s/60s Italian, the '56/60 vette, MB's 350SL, the 1st BMW 'M' & so on are not for the average person (read "costs" & rarity). My beef is the rest0mod so far beyond the oem as to B gosh, gaudy, non-historical. A few mods for safety & performance (?sleeper?) seems right if well thought out and executed. A rice rocket w/fart tubes is OK w/me. I understand. Lookin at what's been done to the "EB" ( I've owned a bronk for 40 yrs) at most of the on-line auctions is a bit embarrassing for me. I saw lets find the business support for the reciently enacted (damn, 12 yrs ago passed?) ability to produce the 25 yr old cars so that we can reach parity w/the other nations on the EV. n Their national economy (public) supports this. We're falling behind...
Zephyr
Advanced Driver

A lot of what you are describing is exactly what was going on in the Ham radio community 20 years ago. Young people (or even older people) trying to enter the hobby and getting dissed by the existing Hams, their big objection being "I had to learn morse code to get a license, so you should too." Their inability to recognize that code was no longer that important and that none of the newbies had any interest in using it, and their attitude that the technology was more important than what you did with it was very discouraging, but what really drove the last nail in the coffin was their outright hostility towards anyone new.
Jack_Hagerty
Moderator

I remember the Morse Code Crisis very well, and this is a solid analogy --- thank you!

Ajakeski
Intermediate Driver

This behavior isn’t new. I experienced it in the early 1990’s. I was into Mopar muscle cars, but couldn’t afford anything nice or desirable at that time. What I could do was body, paint and mechanical work. I also had a lot of free time and energy to work overtime to fund my projects.
I would roll up to a car show and be turned away because my 1972 Demon was ‘Too new’
The same older groups that turned me away were also the ones asking me to work on their cars. That opens the other lane of No-Street as I was more than happy to refuse to work on their cars.
A the years wore on, I’ve seen the same crap and also noticed that younger people aren’t as interested in cars anymore.
We reap what we sow and now the older generation is learning that a little too late.
I’m not as interested in pre-1980’s cars as I was when I was 20. If I’m going to spend tens of thousands of dollars on a four wheeled plaything, it’s going to be something more modern. I guess they killed the thrill for me too.
So, sorry geezers, you’re going to have to come up with another way to buy your way into the Villages.
s083874
Pit Crew

I just turned 61. I still have 2 muscle cars and a 19 Hellcat Challenger. Yea....I'll do an occasionall blast now and ten. But I digress.
I raised two boys who are now grown. One loves cars(if they are European and BMW) and tracks his M2 whenever he can. My other son is an accomplished hockey player(team name omitted) and guitarist but knows to take car of his car.
I have lived in my current house 21 years. I have mentored 4 young kids in the neighborhood.. 3 Dusters and 1 Nova. I showed them how to get them running and maintain them. And never turn them down if they need help...as long as its before 5pm. So I don't know if I'm a gate or ladder. But these 4 kids don't have that 'mine is better than yours' mentality. They just love their cars. I'm proud to have helped them.
bpar73
Intermediate Driver

This type of behavior happens to a degree in all walks of life, but if you are a car guy you notice it there too. Sometimes you just need to move on. I bailed on following a particular SAAB site because it became clear that my '07 9-3 was too "GM" to be a real SAAB. Not worth wasting your time on some people.
david0225
New Driver

I was sixteen with my first car, a Nova. Powered by a 307, had SS trim on the hood. All of the ‘snob’ type people had their say about it being a fake, blah blah blah. Met some great people that knew the position I was in as a young, broke, car nut and made me great deals on parts and did their part to ‘pass it along’ for the hobby’s sake. Those are the people to hang out with. Every hobby- golf, cars, collecting antique knickknacks- has the snob who does it for ‘look what I have, it’s better than what you have’, and has the person who does it for fun. Do it for fun and pass your parts, tools, and knowledge to the next generation as much as you can. I don’t care if the next guy or girl has a 60-inch TV mounted in his back seat- if I’ve got something he or she needs, I’ll be glad to send it their way.

maxwedge
New Driver

I don't take my 1963 Dodge to very many shows or get together's
Most people don't understand what the car is. They just can't conceived that Dodge put an actual
race engine in a 1963 mid size car in the earlier 1960's.
The car sure makes me smile when I take her for a weekend drive. I suppose at 75 I won't have to worry about the future of automobiles. I love them all, 4 doors, wagons, especially original cars...
tmn
Pit Crew

I enjoyed the missive from the young man in his 40's.
In the late 50's and me in my mid teens for me there was the rigid groups of American muscle, European enthusiast, the antique buffs and the Hot Rod set. There was no or little encouragement from a previous generation of "car guys" and I suppose we/me were in the formative stages of the "hobby". One found peers and would switch sides from time to time. Ladders and gates existed than as now and we rarely attempted to recruit except when we needed to sell a project. Yet here we are 60 odd years later with a huge following. The future automobile for transportation compared to the collector or enthusiast automobile could be compared to gourmet cooking and name your own fast food joint. Each exists because there is a need and following. If the need or following declines so will the aficionados. So be it. As long as I can purchase premium fuel and push a clutch pedal I won't care. I also know how to cook.