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Hagerty
Hagerty Employee

Avoidable Contact #140: In which the author buys a new vehicle, somehow

The so-called "supply chain crisis" wouldn't have bothered Henry Ford very much. His River Rouge plant took in raw materials at one end and delivered finished vehicles at the other. Ford's subsidiary enterprises made glass, dug coal, acquired wood. He was vertically integrated, as the kids say nowadays, and he made his own luck.
https://www.hagerty.com/media/opinion/avoidable-contact/avoidable-contact-140-in-which-the-author-bu...
68 REPLIES 68
Mockingbird
Pit Crew

I love this stuff! Excellent writing Mr. Baruth. Although, being the dinosaur I am, I did have to look up "immanentize the eschaton."
SJacobT
Detailer

Dan Neil used the expression in his review of the new WRX a couple months ago - coincidence, I imagine. JB will insist he's channelling Bill Buckley...
Jack_Hagerty
Moderator

Sadly, Danny boy is trailing me by a decade on this. I should probably start reading him, however, so I don't overlap.
Jack_Hagerty
Moderator

Actually Google says he's only trailing me by two years... AC #74 is the first time I used it here.
Gary_Bechtold
Specialist

Hey utopia isn't going to set itself up. We have to be the ones who get it done. By get it done I mean trust the politicians, they totally know what they are doing, from the top down. I can see we are well on our way to this dystopian, err I mean utopian reality right now!

 

Congrats on getting a new vehicle without too much pain.

RokemRonnie
Instructor

Why would anyone associate that phrase with anyone but Buckley?

I'm reminded of the time that Bill Mitchell, head of GM styling, defended the bustle back Cadillac Seville by openly acknowledging its debt to the postwar Hooper bodied Rolls-Royces: “If you’re going to steal, you rob a bank, not a grocery store.”
TG
Technician

apparently it is an internet meme
MATTMERICA
Technician

Where to begin? Let's start with the easy one - carvana. First off, they suck in every way a company can suck. They are literally losing hundreds of millions of dollars ($330 million in '21 to be exact) and aside from clearly being a ponzi scheme, they built those awful car vending machines that will truly be the covid-era equivalent of the dot-com bust. If you bought a vehicle through carvana, well, you get what you deserve. Like the parent companies, Ugly Duckling or the your-credit-is-so-bad you need to shop at DriveTime. That is who "owns" carvana. As for your new truck, good for you. I stopped buying "new" when everybody colluded to offer "no haggle pricing" - if I am going to roll my fat arse to your dealership, you better damn well square off across the table from me, otherwise, why am I here? That is when I found a few websites like carindigo.com and started to enjoy buying very gently used-new cars. $100k bmw with 3,400 miles for $65k? Yes, I will take that, and that was supposedly at the height of the chip shortage and dearth of used autos.....
cosvega76
Pit Crew

I live near the Wentzville, MO, plant. There is a quarry near me - yes, a quarry - filled with Colorados, Canyons, and Express vans waiting for their turn to get chips installed. Hope you're not in a hurry.
58_Plastic_Tub
Intermediate Driver

If you read the article, you will be able to deduce that Mr. Baruth is in possession of the truck right now. The part where he says, "I have a new truck. A brand-new, 31-mile GMC Canyon crew cab." was the first breadcrumb.
Jack_Hagerty
Moderator

Ssshhh... having the readers dunk on me for things I didn't actually do is much more comforting to me than getting raked for my actual mistakes 🙂
cosvega76
Pit Crew

I understand that. Just anyone else looking for one may not be quite so fortunate right now. But there are transports going both ways past my house every day, so they are moving SOME of them out.
Swamibob
Technician

Is a Quarry filled with Canyon's an Irony? I do find it funny. 🙂
ATLpaul
Detailer

Congratulations on your new ride. In the year 2022 to get a new ride shows how truly solid you are in life, what with few cars available and the economy in a state of chaos.

I think a mid-size truck is so much easier to maneuver and park. At least you get a good feel for whether it is right fit for you, and with gas being as high as it is, you may be better off with a smaller truck than a big Ford truck. Again congratulations.

miata93
Advanced Driver

So how long will it be before you can take delivery on the Ford and flip it to Carvana?
Flipping the GMC might still give you the better spread.

 

Your reference to Mig Pilot is genuine:
I can remember when I did an "externship" for several months at a hospital just north of Detroit in the suburbs, not far from "Wide Track Boulevard". This was in the late 70's and the hospital was being visited by an envoy with other people from Russia. After a tour of the facilities that included the patients' rooms and ICU they said, "That was all very nice but please show us where the average person, the "proletariats" receive their healthcare."

 

We don't notice the malaise producing bureaucracy as much today because it all simply gets bundled into the prevailing COVID fatigue. It is much easier to blame a microbe than for people to take responsibility for unsustainable strategies.

Jack_Hagerty
Moderator

Very well said, thank you.
AG1962
Instructor

Was that a county hospital?

RokemRonnie
Instructor

It's either Pontiac General or St. Joseph's.
miata93
Advanced Driver

It was St. Joe's in Pontiac, just south of the loop at the end of Woodward Avenue. As a student I also served at Wayne County General and Henry Ford Hospital. All were excellent in their delivery of health care and would have made the Russian envoy envious.

MWL
Intermediate Driver

But you can blame Covid for revealing those unsustainable strategies, if "blame" is the correct word.
AG1962
Instructor

Smart move, Mr. Baruth. If any vehicle was ever meant to be “just an appliance”, surely a pickup truck would be it. Interesting point about your new truck’s modest width. And kudos for pointing out the utter fragility and hubris of “just in time” sourcing, outsourcing, subcontracting, etc., all of which amount to wage suppression, and eventually enraged working people when their jobs and prospects are “offshored”. No wonder so many people are angry at the folks who have been listening to Friedman and the gospel of neo-liberalism — like the Clintons, the Davos set, merchant bankers, captains of industry, etc. I like the idea of more self-sufficient manufacturing for a lot of reasons, not just disaster-proofing. Even in-house cleaners are happier, do a better job, and are better consumers and taxpayers than out-sourced contract staff.

To answer the question you only hinted at, your F150’s motor was being held up by unhappy workaday Canadians blocking the border — whipped into a rage on Facebook and co-ordinated via Twitter, amplified by Russian democracy-eating bots and trolls, and paid for to some extent by activists in your country. Fortunately, a mix of local and provincial police forces were finally able to slow-walk the Flu Trucks Clan off the borders and out of Ottawa and now we can go back to being the obedient auto-making branch plant we have been since the Autopact was signed back in 1965. FWIW, it is often cheaper to build cars in Canada, depending on the exchange rate, of course, because even though the wages can be higher, the automaker does not have to shell out for employees’ private health insurance plans — the province’s general revenues and money transferred from the feds fund the main public health care plan, and only side benefits like eye care, dental, and, say, remedial hockey or curling lessons are provided by the employer.

RokemRonnie
Instructor

If the blockade of the Ambassador Bridge by Freedom Convoy protesters was so harmful to auto manufacturing, why did Gov. Gretchen Whitmer and Canadian officials keep the access ramps to bridge closed for almost a day after protesters dispersed?
AG1962
Instructor

Because an inchoate mob of people angry about a dozen unrelated things was still milling about right there in Windsor and no-one wanted a re-occupation, so they waited for people to simmer down and disperse. Or do you have a more convincing reason? Your question suggests that the border shut-down did not really affect manufacturing, which would be troll-factory disinformation. But surely you don’t mean that.

Jack_Hagerty
Moderator

I saw it as more of a blatant power flex on the proles, but I am always willing to listen to any post that uses "inchoate".
RokemRonnie
Instructor

Ooh, "disinformation". You've been trained well. Pavlov's dog was a more independant thinker. I'm sure you think you're smarter than folks who don't use words like inchoate and that the world would be a better place if people just listened to you and did what you say. Sure, commisar.

Just saying, if the bridge is that important to the Michigan economy, why did Gov. Whitmer have the MSP block the U.S. side of the bridge for nearly a day? She must seen some kind of political advantage in the move otherwise she wouldn't have done it. Automatons like you seem to approve.
DUB6
Specialist

I'd quit worrying about heated seats and G90s and focus on what's first on the list: deer-proof grill guard. Quickly, Jack, quickly.
TG
Technician

I am glad I have never had much desire for new vehicles... my current newest is a 2012, and it is better than a decade newer than my last newest
I tend to prefer to let others fight with dealers and eat depreciation
hyperv6
Racer

A fool and his money are soon parted.

I too am an owner of a Canyon Denali. I love the truck but I would wait it out before I would pay what you paid.

In fact I got my Denali for the price of a SLT because the Denali is a slow mover due to the price.

6 months from now we will be upon the cusp of the new GM mid size trucks and I expect supplies to be up and with the economy sales will be down for all.

Sometimes you need to wait for the deal to come to you.
Jack_Hagerty
Moderator

This would be great advice if I didn't need a truck for the spring and summer. Thank you. Happily I'm not in a place where I have to skip 6-9 months of racing cars and bikes so I can get a better deal on America's second cheapest truck after the Maverick.
hyperv6
Racer

Jack,

 

If you think that was the second cheapest truck over a Maverick then I understand how you came to buy it. 

It is not the second cheapest. 

 

Jack_Hagerty
Moderator

$25,435 for a base Colorado is the second cheapest new truck for sale in America. Ranger, Tacoma, Frontier, Santa Cruz, Ridgeline are all more expensive.

Let's go back to your advice to sit on my hands for the better part of a year while I wait to save a few grand on a truck. I liked that advice, because it assumed that we would all live forever.
hyperv6
Racer

Actually till the shortage the WT was able to be had for $19,000 as I shopped them in San Diego for a family member. 
Yet many say they never could find a cheap truck?


My take was based on you bought the most expensive GMC mid size from GM. A wise choice as I also own a Denali myself. 

If you are fine with your choice no reason to defend it. In my observation it injustice my opinion right now that it is just the most horrible time to buy a vehicle.

 

We just bought the wife an Acadia Denali last July. We got  around $8,000 off sticker. Also got a major trade in price too. It really was a good time to move. 

Today that same dealer has a market adjusted price of $3,000 added to it. 

I really don’t think you a fool as that is just the saying. But I do feel this was not a good deal and I would have tried six ways to Sunday even for a temporary option. 

You may not of had any but in my case I know I could work a couple. 

Right now they are solid on price but if you go to trade Laura GMC in IL often has deals worth driving there for. 

Don’t let my post bother you. It is just another opinion like all here. Like you I’m not always right either. 

RokemRonnie
Instructor

“He’s just as good as anyone else nowadays, I guess.”

My UPS account was hacked last month by some scammers sending out forged checks. UPS knew about it because, according to the tracking information, almost all of them had been intercepted and were being held by UPS' fraud department or by a government agency. I haven't used my UPS account in a while and I only found out there was a problem because the scammers got some addresses wrong and UPS "returned" them to me. Before I was able to cancel it, my debit card was dinged to the tune of about $450.

UPS knew that I was the victim of fraud, but they never contacted me. Instead I had to jump through hoops to get them to refund my money. That's because 100% of UPS customer support is done via offshore call centers, and those people only have enough authority to read a script.

None of the call center employees cares about UPS keeping me as a customer, and apparently neither does UPS as a company.
TomBrattin
Intermediate Driver

Talk about script readers. I was calling my dearly departed mother's health insurance company to try to clean up some pending bills as part of settling her estate. After getting through to a real person, I introduced myself as the Executor of my mother's estate, and asked for the information I needed. The help person then asked if I could put my mother on the phone to verify they were allowed to talk to me on her behalf. I repeated that I was calling on behalf of my mother's estate and they repeated the ask to speak to my mother. After some silence on my part, I finally had to say "I'm sorry you cannot talk to her, she is dead." That finally registered and I got my response. They were so busy trying to identify which script they should read me they did not even listen to what I was saying.
Jnick
Detailer

We just bought a new F150 off the lot with an eco boost engine and all the bells and whistles. It is smooth comfortable and reasonably fast, my wife asked me to listen carefully to the salesman to figure out all the features but I now realize I’m in over my head. I love the bright red truck but am unqualified to operate it. It has lights and cameras and switches and phone connects and all kinds of fun stuff that probably would prove useful, but it’s like driving to Boeing to order a 777, sure it’s all there but now what do I do?
I have a 1939 Dodge truck which rattles and squeaks, rides like a buck board, tops out about 50 MPH, leaks during a rainstorm but by God it’s a truck in every sense of the word good and bad.
I also have a Sprite which feels great in the corners but leaks in the rain is slower than molasses, is generally too cold or hot, and is the practical definition of unreliable.
It’s like comparing the Jetsons with the Flintstones. I just can’t for the life of me figure why I love driving my Dodge and Sprite, must be something wrong with me! Did anyone else over the age of 60 ever figure out these new fangled vehicles or have I just been left behind by civilization fending off Saber tooth tigers and Woolley Mammoths.
Jack_Hagerty
Moderator

Yeah but does your 1939 Dodge have a shifter that electronically folds into the console?

🙂
Ark-med
Detailer

Heck, I'd be surprised if the old Dodge, or the Sprite, have rev-limiters.
61Rampy
Instructor

They do! It's just that their limiters are more permanent when engaged. (Rods out of the block, bent valves or pushrods)
CitationMan
Gearhead

Many companies need to re-centralize their production, but who in these companies will be brave enough to say it out loud, much less actually implement it. It's obvious from the events of the last two years what needs to be done, but visionary corporate management is the biggest supply shortage this country has.
SJ
Technician

Guess I am just pigheaded but I rarely don't get what I want, I have learned the virtue of patience in most cases. I just couldn't see myself rationalizing the purchase of what was easy to settle for. At least it wasn't a Ram.
mechimike
Intermediate Driver

Unfortunately, we found ourselves in a situation similar to Jack's, and this week placed a down payment at the dealer for a brand new vehicle. No haggling, no dealer mark-up, straight MSRP, minus a small MFR rebate which may or may not still be around when the vehicle actually ships. Luckily, the vehicle slated for replacement is still functioning at the moment *knock on wood* so we're able to wait and see just how long it takes for "the chips" to get plugged into the new one- which we're assured is waiting patiently, otherwise assembled, at the factory in Michigan.

Kudos for grabbing up one of these trucks, Jack. We looked hard at them prior to pulling the trigger on something else. I read next year the V6 will be gone, replaced with the turbo 2.7 from the full sizers- which adds complexity and from what I can tell, delivers no better real-world fuel economy or capability.
Jack_Hagerty
Moderator

I didn't go into this above, but I found a really great deal on a 2022 Silverado Custom extra-cab with the 2.7 turbo. Would have been four grand less than the Denali, but from what I've read the turbo four-banger is not yet a reliable engine.
mechimike
Intermediate Driver

I checked a few dealers local to me, and did find a few of those full-sizers in stock, with the 2.7T. So I figured (correctly, as it turns out) your decision to go with the Canyon was influenced by that.

My father owns one of the last full-sizers built with the 4.3 Ecotec V6, and he routinely surpasses the EPA estimates with it.
compaqdeskpro
Detailer

We should ignore Ukraine, get the engineers out of Taiwan ASAP, and put them to work in Arizona, build the iPhones in Brazil.
js100
Detailer

When the misfortune of a glancing intersection interception resulted in unrepairable frame damage to the front corner of my wife's 4 year old Toyota Dog Hauler, aka Sienna, we were in the same position of immediate need. The replacement Toyota van is now sluggish and very expensive at $47K, plus the generous dealer adds that pushed this rolling dog crate well over $54K. With one to choose from, no time to decide, as they literally had another customer waiting to buy it, if we passed. Pass we did, it sold instantly, and we moved on to the Honda dealer. They also had one available, with a minor pack of only $9K over sticker no negotiating, I refused, after decoding how many hours of my time equaled $9k in net income, to give to these villains. We gave up all hope and visited the Chrysler dealer, which had not seen our faces since the lease return of our last Town & Country 13 years ago. They actually had a minor selection of what seemed to be well-built Pacificas, were considerate and agreed to sell at MSRP plus a few silly adds (can't drive without etched glass and nitrogen in the tires, after all). At the end of that day, all I felt was relief, resignation and commented that this experience was a much fun as buying a new dryer. This situation has sucked all the enjoyment out of getting of a new vehicle, and exposed the faults of JIT production and the corrupt, century-old dealer model. Why can't I just order a new van on the internet, pay a retail price, and have it delivered when built? Oh yea, Tesla doesn't make a van.
compaqdeskpro
Detailer

But what about test drives? You'll be fine with the Pacifica, Pentastar and ZF-9 speed are reliable parts, I remember their interior being equal to Honda and much better than Toyota. What about Kia Carnival?
js100
Detailer

Kia is unobtainium, with $10K packs, if they magically appear.  Except for the doggy CVT Toyota, they drive the same. The Pacifica has actually been a pleasant surprise, if it holds together, I may change my opinion of this other import (built in Canada with Mexican parts, by a French / Italian company).  Walter must be spinning in his grave.

buellerdan
Instructor

I don't consider my 2017 Canyon to be a "baby truck". Compared to my S-10, it's closer to what a full size truck once was. As time goes on and things get bigger, our perceptions change, I suppose.
richard2
Intermediate Driver

Excellent story, Jack. Also some good stories in the comments.
Mine is similar but different (sorry!). I too lost my truck (2008 Ford Ranger FX4) in an accident that was officially categorized as 'collision with road'. (???). A guard rail on a black-ice bridge during a horrific winter storm tore off the front end of the truck, effectively totalling it. On Christmas day.

So what to do? Well, it took a while, but I replaced the totalled ranger with a Tacoma. But NOT new. I live off the west coast of Canada, and new trucks of ALL brands are simply unobtainable at any price. It's a 6 month+ waiting game if you order one, and I needed it before summer.

In the end I bought the only Tacoma in the area - a 2019 fully loaded TRD Sport dual cab that I just love. I would have gladly bought new, but this truck is nearly new and was obtained at a more reasonable cost (none of the shenanigans you mentioned in your article).

So some of us 'had' to buy used as new was simply not an option. But used is not all that bad in this case.